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![]( "A respected member of the community, with consistent helpful posts")
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 10:42:58
This is soooo funny.Yet so fucking stupid
Listen guys.
Im gonna try and say this in a nice way.
CHILL THE FUCK OUT MOTHA FUCKERS
Who cares about all the shit you guys are on about. STOP swinging your dicks around and see whos is bigger. Now the whole worlds people are involved and shame the guy was only asking about Pretoria.
FUCK ME!! You guys are going on like a bunch of kids. Sorry kids dont even go on like this.
GIVE IT UP ALREADY AND MOVE ON
Listen guys.
Im gonna try and say this in a nice way.
CHILL THE FUCK OUT MOTHA FUCKERS
Who cares about all the shit you guys are on about. STOP swinging your dicks around and see whos is bigger. Now the whole worlds people are involved and shame the guy was only asking about Pretoria.
FUCK ME!! You guys are going on like a bunch of kids. Sorry kids dont even go on like this.
GIVE IT UP ALREADY AND MOVE ON
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 10:57:07
I'm sure they're only talking to each other and the only ones reading it. Don't tell me you've been reading all those essays in the debate or argument or love story or whatever they're having?
Let them have at it.
JP69
On 2025-11-28 10:42:58 Pumpkineater said:
This is soooo funny.Yet so fucking stupid
Listen guys.
Im gonna try and say this in a nice way.
CHILL THE FUCK OUT MOTHA FUCKERS
Who cares about all the shit you guys are on about. STOP swinging your dicks around and see whos is bigger. Now the whole worlds people are involved and shame the guy was only asking about Pretoria.
FUCK ME!! You guys are going on like a bunch of kids. Sorry kids dont even go on like this.
GIVE IT UP ALREADY AND MOVE ON
I'm sure they're only talking to each other and the only ones reading it. Don't tell me you've been reading all those essays in the debate or argument or love story or whatever they're having?
Let them have at it.
JP69
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 11:33:29
Nee fok. I definitely didnt read it. I just saw the words in capital letters scrolling down to where i can post
On 2025-11-28 10:57:07 JackParrow69 said:
On 2025-11-28 10:42:58 Pumpkineater said: This is soooo funny.Yet so fucking stupid
Listen guys.
Im gonna try and say this in a nice way.
CHILL THE FUCK OUT MOTHA FUCKERS
Who cares about all the shit you guys are on about. STOP swinging your dicks around and see whos is bigger. Now the whole worlds people are involved and shame the guy was only asking about Pretoria.
FUCK ME!! You guys are going on like a bunch of kids. Sorry kids dont even go on like this.
GIVE IT UP ALREADY AND MOVE ON
I'm sure they're only talking to each other and the only ones reading it. Don't tell me you've been reading all those essays in the debate or argument or love story or whatever they're having?
Let them have at it.
JP69
Nee fok. I definitely didnt read it. I just saw the words in capital letters scrolling down to where i can post
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 12:54:24
1. "So if cultures differ, that means some are superior, right??"
Lol. No. My response was a sarcastic mimicking of your position to turn it into a jab at you. (Do I need to label things with /s every time I write something sarcastic? Is that the level you are operating on?) Besides which you have made an enormous leap from talking about individual "cultural values" to ranking cultures. Japanese culture historically values honour, even to the point of death before dishonour. Fathers would commit hari-kari if their children brought dishonour to their family. To someone like me, that's a very strange concept. Is it inferior? Superior? No, its just different. Noticing difference doesn't imply a ranking. And even if you think that on that one value the Japanese value is better, that wouldn't translate into "Japanese culture is superior", it would just translate into "the Japanese cultural conception of this one thing is superior".
3. The horn of Africa
So...Let me get this straight... you dutifully googled the examples I gave, saw that Ge'ez script originated in the horn of Africa and got so over-excited you neglected to ask google the follow up question: "Is the horn of Africa considered part of sub-Saharan Africa? " You might have embarrassed yourself a bit less if you'd actually bothered to double check. (As to your "go read a geography book", I challenge you to find a geography book that says that the horn of Africa is not considered as part of Sub-Saharan Africa...I'll wait)
Your redefinition of Sub-Saharan Africa is probably the most patheticly dishonest thing I've seen in quite a long time.
Also, your attempt to disqualify Ajami because it uses Arabic script is adorable. Following that rule:
* Europeans had "no writing" because they borrowed from the Phoenicians.
* Japanese had "no writing" because they borrowed from China.
* Koreans had "no writing" until the 15th century.
Cultures borrow scripts. That's how this has worked the world over.
Your fallback is even better:
"Nsibidi doesn't count because I've decided it shouldn't."
If you redefine "writing" until only your preferred civilizations qualify you're not engaging in good faith. By your logic, Chinese "didn't have writing" for most of its history. Nsibidi fulfills the definition of writing used in anthropology: conventionalized visual symbols capable of conveying meaning across contexts. Please stop attempting to move the goalposts.
Wheel & Tsetse
Your ChatGPT "gotcha" is priceless --- your question "Is Sub-Saharan Africa unsuitable for roads?" is phrased such that it asks whether modern Sub-Saharan Africa is suitable for paved roads today, after 150 years of improved technology, globalised engineering, bulldozers, asphalt plants, satellite surveying, and industrial supply chains... and then triumphantly acted like the answer somehow applies to pre-colonial transport ecology.
Cute. But also very, very stupid. You might as well ask whether "Sub-Saharan Africa is suitable for airports" and then use the answer to argue that the Nok people should've invented the Boeing 737.
The constraints that shaped transport development weren't:
* today's engineering capacity, but
* pre-industrial animal survivability, climate patterns, soil erosion, seasonal rainfall, and the complete absence of draft animals in half the region because tsetse flies annihilated them.
For societies without surviving oxen, horses, donkeys, or mules, wheels are costly toys, not infrastructure.
More to the point though, the entire premise of your question is false: Pre-colonial African societies *DID* have the wheel -- its usage just wasn't widespread. Since you like chatgpt here's its answer:
Archaeological and historical evidence shows the wheel appeared in several contexts:
Iron Age West Africa (present-day Nigeria)
* Nok culture (c. 1000 BCE -- 300 CE) produced terracotta figurines showing wheeled carts or wheels.
* This confirms awareness of wheeled technology very early.
Sahel and Savannah Kingdoms
* Written accounts from Islamic travelers (e.g., Ibn Battuta) mention carts used in the Mali Empire.
* Horses and donkeys pulled carts in regions outside heavy tsetse fly zones.
Ethiopia
* Evidence of wheeled millstones, chariots in earlier periods, and carts in certain highland regions.
Southern Africa
* Bantu-speaking farmers used domestic wheeled devices like potter's wheels and simple carts in some regions.
* European observers in the early 1500s--1700s noted ox-drawn carts among some Southern African groups before colonization became widespread.
So the wheel was not unknown or absent --- but its usage varied for practical reasons.
Great Zimbabwe
Your argument here is:
"I personally am not impressed by a 900-year-old engineering complex, therefore it doesn't count."
(btw the Taj Mahal was built roughly 200 years after the great ruins had already been abandoned. Its hardly surprising that its in better nick)
Mali Empire
Your reasoning:
"Mali was successful, therefore it doesn't count, because Islam was involved."
By this logic:
* Europe's achievements belong to the Middle East
* All Asian literacy belongs to China
* The modern world belongs to Mesopotamia
But if the rule only activates when Africans succeed, then it's not a rule --- it's a coping strategy.
6. IQ
Fact check:
* IQ differences track nutrition, schooling, infectious disease loads, and inequality --- not genetics
* Migrants from low-scoring regions see their "group average" jump within one generation
Your reply to the genetics point might be the single worst misfire in the entire thread --- and that's in a competition full of contenders.
The statement was very simple:
Genetic variation within continental populations is greater than variation between them. This is one of the most replicated findings in population genetics. Lewontin (1972), Nei & Roychoudhury (1982), Rosenberg et al. (2002), modern whole-genome datasets --- they all converge on the same conclusion:
You cannot reliably sort individuals into behavioural or cognitive categories by continent because the functional genetic differences are tiny and heavily overlapping.
Your response?
"So why are there huge differences in IQ between continental populations?? So by this logic a Nigerian is more genetically different from another Nigerian than from a Korean?? Makes sense..."
This isn't an a priori argument based solely on logic. Its an empirical fact about the world that has been verified several times over. What's that thing you red-pilled morons like to repeat?: Facts don't care about your feelings. (Besides which you've totally fucked up your statement of the implication of that fact)
Here's what you bungled:
i) You confused genetic variation with IQ scores, as if IQ is a direct readout of DNA instead of the single most environment-sensitive metric in psychology. This is like hearing "height is mostly genetic" and responding, "Then why do malnourished children grow up short? Checkmate, science."
ii) You seem to have interpreted "more variation within populations" as "everyone in Africa is genetically unrelated to each other."
No serious person has ever made that claim.
It means: the range of genetic diversity inside a continent is large, not that individuals are aliens to their neighbors.
iii) You somehow concluded that this implies a Nigerian is genetically closer to a Korean than to another Nigerian --- a thing no scientist has ever said and that is not even remotely implied by what I wrote. What is entirely possible is that the Nigerian *might* be genetically closer to a Korean than he is to a Khoisan.
iv)You ignored the entire point of the argument:
If between-group differences are small compared to within-group differences, then using continental averages to predict individual traits is nonsense. That's the whole point.
That is what every geneticist keeps telling people who try to smuggle racism in through the side door of "biology."
But basically, we've reached the part of the discussion where R2D4 just make shit up. It happens in every discussion he takes part in. He is the living definition of arguing in bad faith. In a single post he has re-defined the geography of Africa, redefined the definition of 'writing', and denied the existence of literal decades of genetic research -- all because they are inconvenient to his prejudices.
I'm half-tempted to think that he is trying to prove his point by living up to his own race's stereotype for dishonesty... but fortunately those of us who aren't blinded by prejudice know that just because he, as an individual, is unbelievably dishonest (and stupid), it doesn't imply anything about those who share his race.
1. "So if cultures differ, that means some are superior, right??"
Lol. No. My response was a sarcastic mimicking of your position to turn it into a jab at you. (Do I need to label things with /s every time I write something sarcastic? Is that the level you are operating on?) Besides which you have made an enormous leap from talking about individual "cultural values" to ranking cultures. Japanese culture historically values honour, even to the point of death before dishonour. Fathers would commit hari-kari if their children brought dishonour to their family. To someone like me, that's a very strange concept. Is it inferior? Superior? No, its just different. Noticing difference doesn't imply a ranking. And even if you think that on that one value the Japanese value is better, that wouldn't translate into "Japanese culture is superior", it would just translate into "the Japanese cultural conception of this one thing is superior".
3. The horn of Africa
So...Let me get this straight... you dutifully googled the examples I gave, saw that Ge'ez script originated in the horn of Africa and got so over-excited you neglected to ask google the follow up question: "Is the horn of Africa considered part of sub-Saharan Africa? " You might have embarrassed yourself a bit less if you'd actually bothered to double check. (As to your "go read a geography book", I challenge you to find a geography book that says that the horn of Africa is not considered as part of Sub-Saharan Africa...I'll wait)
Your redefinition of Sub-Saharan Africa is probably the most patheticly dishonest thing I've seen in quite a long time.
Also, your attempt to disqualify Ajami because it uses Arabic script is adorable. Following that rule:
* Europeans had "no writing" because they borrowed from the Phoenicians.
* Japanese had "no writing" because they borrowed from China.
* Koreans had "no writing" until the 15th century.
Cultures borrow scripts. That's how this has worked the world over.
Your fallback is even better:
"Nsibidi doesn't count because I've decided it shouldn't."
If you redefine "writing" until only your preferred civilizations qualify you're not engaging in good faith. By your logic, Chinese "didn't have writing" for most of its history. Nsibidi fulfills the definition of writing used in anthropology: conventionalized visual symbols capable of conveying meaning across contexts. Please stop attempting to move the goalposts.
Wheel & Tsetse
Your ChatGPT "gotcha" is priceless --- your question "Is Sub-Saharan Africa unsuitable for roads?" is phrased such that it asks whether modern Sub-Saharan Africa is suitable for paved roads today, after 150 years of improved technology, globalised engineering, bulldozers, asphalt plants, satellite surveying, and industrial supply chains... and then triumphantly acted like the answer somehow applies to pre-colonial transport ecology.
Cute. But also very, very stupid. You might as well ask whether "Sub-Saharan Africa is suitable for airports" and then use the answer to argue that the Nok people should've invented the Boeing 737.
The constraints that shaped transport development weren't:
* today's engineering capacity, but
* pre-industrial animal survivability, climate patterns, soil erosion, seasonal rainfall, and the complete absence of draft animals in half the region because tsetse flies annihilated them.
For societies without surviving oxen, horses, donkeys, or mules, wheels are costly toys, not infrastructure.
More to the point though, the entire premise of your question is false: Pre-colonial African societies *DID* have the wheel -- its usage just wasn't widespread. Since you like chatgpt here's its answer:
Archaeological and historical evidence shows the wheel appeared in several contexts:
Iron Age West Africa (present-day Nigeria)
* Nok culture (c. 1000 BCE -- 300 CE) produced terracotta figurines showing wheeled carts or wheels.
* This confirms awareness of wheeled technology very early.
Sahel and Savannah Kingdoms
* Written accounts from Islamic travelers (e.g., Ibn Battuta) mention carts used in the Mali Empire.
* Horses and donkeys pulled carts in regions outside heavy tsetse fly zones.
Ethiopia
* Evidence of wheeled millstones, chariots in earlier periods, and carts in certain highland regions.
Southern Africa
* Bantu-speaking farmers used domestic wheeled devices like potter's wheels and simple carts in some regions.
* European observers in the early 1500s--1700s noted ox-drawn carts among some Southern African groups before colonization became widespread.
So the wheel was not unknown or absent --- but its usage varied for practical reasons.
Great Zimbabwe
Your argument here is:
"I personally am not impressed by a 900-year-old engineering complex, therefore it doesn't count."
(btw the Taj Mahal was built roughly 200 years after the great ruins had already been abandoned. Its hardly surprising that its in better nick)
Mali Empire
Your reasoning:
"Mali was successful, therefore it doesn't count, because Islam was involved."
By this logic:
* Europe's achievements belong to the Middle East
* All Asian literacy belongs to China
* The modern world belongs to Mesopotamia
But if the rule only activates when Africans succeed, then it's not a rule --- it's a coping strategy.
6. IQ
Fact check:
* IQ differences track nutrition, schooling, infectious disease loads, and inequality --- not genetics
* Migrants from low-scoring regions see their "group average" jump within one generation
Your reply to the genetics point might be the single worst misfire in the entire thread --- and that's in a competition full of contenders.
The statement was very simple:
Genetic variation within continental populations is greater than variation between them. This is one of the most replicated findings in population genetics. Lewontin (1972), Nei & Roychoudhury (1982), Rosenberg et al. (2002), modern whole-genome datasets --- they all converge on the same conclusion:
You cannot reliably sort individuals into behavioural or cognitive categories by continent because the functional genetic differences are tiny and heavily overlapping.
Your response?
"So why are there huge differences in IQ between continental populations?? So by this logic a Nigerian is more genetically different from another Nigerian than from a Korean?? Makes sense..."
This isn't an a priori argument based solely on logic. Its an empirical fact about the world that has been verified several times over. What's that thing you red-pilled morons like to repeat?: Facts don't care about your feelings. (Besides which you've totally fucked up your statement of the implication of that fact)
Here's what you bungled:
i) You confused genetic variation with IQ scores, as if IQ is a direct readout of DNA instead of the single most environment-sensitive metric in psychology. This is like hearing "height is mostly genetic" and responding, "Then why do malnourished children grow up short? Checkmate, science."
ii) You seem to have interpreted "more variation within populations" as "everyone in Africa is genetically unrelated to each other."
No serious person has ever made that claim.
It means: the range of genetic diversity inside a continent is large, not that individuals are aliens to their neighbors.
iii) You somehow concluded that this implies a Nigerian is genetically closer to a Korean than to another Nigerian --- a thing no scientist has ever said and that is not even remotely implied by what I wrote. What is entirely possible is that the Nigerian *might* be genetically closer to a Korean than he is to a Khoisan.
iv)You ignored the entire point of the argument:
If between-group differences are small compared to within-group differences, then using continental averages to predict individual traits is nonsense. That's the whole point.
That is what every geneticist keeps telling people who try to smuggle racism in through the side door of "biology."
But basically, we've reached the part of the discussion where R2D4 just make shit up. It happens in every discussion he takes part in. He is the living definition of arguing in bad faith. In a single post he has re-defined the geography of Africa, redefined the definition of 'writing', and denied the existence of literal decades of genetic research -- all because they are inconvenient to his prejudices.
I'm half-tempted to think that he is trying to prove his point by living up to his own race's stereotype for dishonesty... but fortunately those of us who aren't blinded by prejudice know that just because he, as an individual, is unbelievably dishonest (and stupid), it doesn't imply anything about those who share his race.
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 12:56:46
@pumpkineater - is there anything more pointless than joining a conversation to basically say "I don't find this conversation very interesting" ?
Um, ok... good for you... I guess.
Um, ok... good for you... I guess.
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 13:27:11
My question to u. With all the back and forth debate. Did u solve the ROAR issue in pretoria.
On 2025-11-28 12:56:46 Teletubby said:
@pumpkineater - is there anything more pointless than joining a conversation to basically say "I don't find this conversation very interesting" ?
Um, ok... good for you... I guess.
My question to u. With all the back and forth debate. Did u solve the ROAR issue in pretoria.
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 13:47:03
No. Wasn't trying to. That's not how the forum, or conversations in general, work. If someone raises a topic, the list of permitted responses is not limited to trying to provide a solution.
On 2025-11-28 13:27:11 Pumpkineater said:
On 2025-11-28 12:56:46 Teletubby said: @pumpkineater - is there anything more pointless than joining a conversation to basically say "I don't find this conversation very interesting" ?
Um, ok... good for you... I guess.
My question to u. With all the back and forth debate. Did u solve the ROAR issue in pretoria.
No. Wasn't trying to. That's not how the forum, or conversations in general, work. If someone raises a topic, the list of permitted responses is not limited to trying to provide a solution.
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 15:02:27
Sure: check out the backpedaling here:
www.esa.co.za/forum/thread.php
His previous username was either banned or deleted, but its pretty easy to see who I'm talking about.
But if you want a real good laugh read the meltdown he had when a lady took him for 90k, (also under a deleted username):
www.esa.co.za/forum/thread.php
On 2025-11-27 21:51:48 SneakyOctopuss said:
@Teletubby - you mentioned "and you famously scampered off when someone took you up on it. lol.". Could you elaborate for those of us who missed this delightful story?
Sure: check out the backpedaling here:
www.esa.co.za/forum/thread.php
His previous username was either banned or deleted, but its pretty easy to see who I'm talking about.
But if you want a real good laugh read the meltdown he had when a lady took him for 90k, (also under a deleted username):
www.esa.co.za/forum/thread.php
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Re: ROAR Capital City!
Posted: 2025-11-28 16:53:12
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...
wait, wait
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
On 2025-11-28 15:02:27 Teletubby said:
On 2025-11-27 21:51:48 SneakyOctopuss said:
@Teletubby - you mentioned "and you famously scampered off when someone took you up on it. lol.". Could you elaborate for those of us who missed this delightful story?
Sure: check out the backpedaling here:
www.esa.co.za/forum/thread.php
His previous username was either banned or deleted, but its pretty easy to see who I'm talking about.
But if you want a real good laugh read the meltdown he had when a lady took him for 90k, (also under a deleted username):
www.esa.co.za/forum/thread.php
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...
wait, wait
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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